tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post7998558692987680935..comments2024-03-05T19:29:18.578-07:00Comments on ARE THEY ALL YOURS?!??: Abortion Practitioner Loses Medical License for Killing Wrong Twin in Failed AbortionZsuzsannahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03062136377263894876noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-70295183448474319772014-01-18T10:08:25.844-07:002014-01-18T10:08:25.844-07:00I also disagree with the broad generalization of I...I also disagree with the broad generalization of IVF patients also...my husband and I have twins from the procedure and we thank God for giving them to us. We would not have aborted any of them if they had problems and made that clear to our doctors. The difference is between unbelievers and enemies of God who would do that against believers who wouldn't, not between people who use IVF and those who don't.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-62239975177040227842011-01-19T02:28:00.011-07:002011-01-19T02:28:00.011-07:00You're so wrong about IVF. My daughter was bo...You're so wrong about IVF. My daughter was born as a result of multiple rounds of IVF. She was a twin, and we lost her sister. That crushed us.<br /><br />People who go through IVF are desperate, and are so much less likely to abort an "imperfect" baby that someone who conceived naturally. We may not get another chance to have a baby. Why would we infertile women abort the chance we finally have?<br /><br />As to your birth control blaming, I was rendered infertile after being hit by a car when I was in a crosswalk. The subsequent damage to my body included my fallopian tubes being crushed. So. Is it somehow the fault of birth control?~*Aria*~https://www.blogger.com/profile/07201270600422167290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-7521688155765330442010-09-10T01:05:51.336-07:002010-09-10T01:05:51.336-07:00People think adoption "isn't good enough&...People think adoption "isn't good enough" because it is cost prohibitive and requires so much red tape, and not everyone is equipped to adopt a special needs child, which there is an abundance of in the foster care/adoption system. If people can afford it and it is the right way for them, good, but it is natural for a woman to want a child made of love between her and her partner.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-44044874208590205102010-06-01T20:33:06.285-07:002010-06-01T20:33:06.285-07:00This is sad. We are infertile, but trusting god, I...This is sad. We are infertile, but trusting god, If we cannot conceive (or even if we do at some point) We will look into and pray about adoption through the foster care system.CalicoJennhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05117621190007794406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-66810032037455345232010-05-01T11:44:15.400-07:002010-05-01T11:44:15.400-07:00How many babies test positive for Down's Syndr...How many babies test positive for Down's Syndrome, only to be born withOUT it?! TOO MANY. That baby might have been fine...the parents will never know now...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-59095653569210763332010-04-29T19:00:31.361-07:002010-04-29T19:00:31.361-07:00Despite all of the comments here that go every whi...Despite all of the comments here that go every which way they can. I think bottom line that this whole deal is horrible. A child was murdered, regardless of how it got where it was or even the fact it was the "wrong" one. What is this world coming to?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00444896414475893411noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-25080135479415494182010-04-28T23:23:32.191-07:002010-04-28T23:23:32.191-07:00"This story once again proves my opinion that..."This story once again proves my opinion that people who use IVF are obsessed with having a perfect token child to add to their perfectly planned out life"<br /><br />I have to comment on this statement. I have been trying to conceive for seven years and have met many other woman in a similar position on the way. I've never come across any couple that does IVF to have a 'perfect' child. So I'm just wondering where you get that idea from. <br /><br />It's definitely not ok to stereotype an entire group based on a couple of articles.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-92212195581159683592010-04-27T15:57:29.518-07:002010-04-27T15:57:29.518-07:00This is so sad.
I don't understand why these p...This is so sad.<br />I don't understand why these people don't think adoption is good enough.<br /><br />CassieAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-19760128260150361642010-04-26T16:40:35.202-07:002010-04-26T16:40:35.202-07:00I don't have kids...have been trying to have k...I don't have kids...have been trying to have kids for years. I found out about a month ago that I have a neuro-muscular disease (myotonic dystrophy to be exact - google it). MD itself doesn't cause infertility, but it does cause insulin resistance which is believed to cause PCOS I also have. The PCOS I can overcome -- burying my child because I passed on congenital MD (fatal usually in utero or in infancy but do not survive past 12-15 years old usually) is something I cannot and will not live with. Call me selfish for that I suppose!<br /><br />I agree to disagree with you. I'm sure you're right that some do IVF out of the "perfect child" syndrome, but I'd be willing to bet the vast majority who go down the IVF path aren't doing it just for the fun of things. From talking to those who have done the IVF thing -- it is anything but enjoyable or easy. <br /><br />I would like to have the opportunity to have a child - IVF will allow that for me. I did use birth control about 10 years ago, but in my case, birth control has not been in my system for YEARS and YEARS. Having a congenital disease I didn't know existed (because there were not symptoms until very recently), on the other hand has everything to do with my body. I suppose I can thank God for that too.Hopehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02976711831330274977noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-48124539409291772842010-04-26T12:26:05.257-07:002010-04-26T12:26:05.257-07:00Zsuzsanna, I don’t see the connection between abor...Zsuzsanna, I don’t see the connection between abortion due to Down Syndrome and IVF. This is ONE story. There are probably more. But I'm also pretty sure there have been many women who have aborted babies with Down Syndrome who were naturally conceived. On the other end, there are plenty of IVF moms who, like me, haven't done any type of genetic screening to our babies.<br /><br />Where do you get the idea that IVF parents want perfect children? From articles like this one? What exactly do you mean by perfect children anyway, and how does a woman make a perfect child via IVF??? Do you mean women who do PGD to discard abnormal babies? Yes, I agree that could be dangerous; especially when this technology develops in the future and people start choosing sex, eye color, and such. But it is not a reality today. The majority of IVF parents do not undergo PGD. <br /><br />No, I don’t trust God’s plan, I admit it. You can accuse me (generically speaking) of messing up God plans and I will not argue against that (and believe me I do ENVY you for blindly trusting and accepting God’s plan). You can also accuse me/us of killing embryos along the way, and I will not argue against that either---although I will point out that it is possible to do IVF and fertilize only the number of eggs that you are willing to transfer, even though most people don’t do it this way. Aren’t these strong enough arguments to make your point? Why do you need to accuse me of things I’m not guilty of?<br /><br />What if I wanted to make the point that IVF parents are better parents than fertile women? Could I bring up the fact that there’s a lot of drug addicts and prostitutes who get pregnant naturally? Could I bring out the fact that the overwhelming majority of women who choose to have an abortion got pregnant naturally? Where would that argument leave the normal fertile good moms out there? Using this article to claim that IVF parents want perfect children is not very different, really. This is an article about a case of wicked parents and doctor. <br /><br />Zsuzsanna, your family building IS actually going according to your plan. Yes, you are leaving it up to God, but at the same time it is not departing from your expectations. My story is different. Being an only child and grandchild, I always wanted to have many kids. After many years I am finally lucky to have twin daughters. I would love to have a third child, or more, but I doubt it will happen. My life plan HAS been altered and I have adapted to it. I have been forced to depart from my expectations; but it is fine and I am happy with the “perfect but not perfect” family that I have. I have needed to face the possibility of not ever holding my own newborn baby, of not ever nurturing a little soul. If anything, I have become <em>more</em> accepting, not less. Having two kids instead of four... it doesn’t compare to not having any. Having two girls, two boys, one of each, thin, fat, bright, dumb, brown eyes, blue eyes, again, after being faced with the possibility of not having any, who cares?<br /><br />MIAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-80847915315571044922010-04-26T11:24:12.197-07:002010-04-26T11:24:12.197-07:00Wow. First of all, I don't think those parents...Wow. First of all, I don't think those parents deserved to have either twin, if they were going to kill one anyway. Seriously, I can't imagine what they would've had to tell their healthy twin if he/she survived. "You were a twin, but we killed your brother/sister because he/she had Downs Syndrome." What a sick world we live in...<br /><br />Secondly, this is just more proof of how sick abortion really is. I heard about a couple who filed a grievance against their midwife because they gave birth to a child with Downs Syndrome, and they would've aborted the child if they would've known sooner. I've never been in the situation where I was pregnant with a disabled child, but I know I'd never abort a baby for any reason. This whole story just makes me sick.Kathiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09611133240853275142noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-63307277556283654542010-04-26T11:23:11.292-07:002010-04-26T11:23:11.292-07:00Alice, clearly I cannot speak for Zsuszana but in ...Alice, clearly I cannot speak for Zsuszana but in her comment she specifically said she has nothing against you personally but finds IVF morally reprehensible. I think it's more of a case of "love the sinner, hate the sin" (as she sees it.)Linds84https://www.blogger.com/profile/00966226397960302903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-19984314006762585362010-04-26T00:24:00.205-07:002010-04-26T00:24:00.205-07:00Sorry, I meant to add this to my last comment. Do ...Sorry, I meant to add this to my last comment. Do you think that I am morally reprehensible because I used IVF? I don't mind if you do, just interested :) I think I remember you saying that it's due to the creation of embryos. In my case we only managed to get two eggs out of me (long story) which both fertilised, both got put back and only one 'took'. So, unlike a normal IVF I didn't get multiple embryos that are now being stored. Does that make it less reprehensible?<br />I am not sure if my question is coming across properly and I am not baiting you or anything I am just trying to see your point of view. I like a healthy debate and I realise that I am never going to change your mind nor you mine<br />Really, we should get together over a cup of tea; it would be a wonderful conversationAlicehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04080737213758433563noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-50620749594426086022010-04-26T00:17:40.337-07:002010-04-26T00:17:40.337-07:00Yes, you are right, I did go onto have a second ch...Yes, you are right, I did go onto have a second child naturally. I will give you a bit of a background to explain this. We tried for two years to conceive and then went down the testing road to find out what was going on. I had what is called a Hysterosalpingogram which is where they push dye through your tubes to see if they are clear. Mine was inconclusive so I had a lapratomy (I can't remember how that is spelt, sorry) and it was discovered that both my tubes were completely blocked and one was particularly bad in that it was a hydrosalpnix. So, yes, I was infertile. There was no way that a sperm and egg could meet up under those circumstances. And, funnily enough, I had always thought there was a blockage. I had always had a feeling that something was stopping me which is why I refused to take Clomid (a drug which forces your body to super-ovulate)<br />Anyway, it was decided that IVF was the only way to go and I was exceptionally lucky that my specialist was very conservative because it many, many cases both tubes are removed. My specialist had read of cases were women with blocked tubes had gone on to have spontaneous pregnancies due to increased blood flow to the uterus clearing the tubes out. I was very lucky to be one of those women<br />If you have any more questions for me, I am happy to share but I do know that I will never change your mind :)Alicehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04080737213758433563noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-85567794248064938962010-04-25T21:59:38.208-07:002010-04-25T21:59:38.208-07:00Alice (and Hope),
if you are saying that your fir...Alice (and Hope),<br /><br />if you are saying that your first child was conceived through IVF, am I right in my assumption that you later had another child that was conceived naturally? If that is the case, all that would prove is that you were/are not infertile. <br /><br />I have never seen a statistic on this, but I would be willing to guess that the vast majority of people who are "infertile" AND resort to IVF have used hormonal birth control in the past. <br /><br />Imagine if I sprayed my yard with pesticides every single month, for years. One day I decide I want to grow vegetables, and throw some seeds out. Would you be surprised if they did not come up right away? Can you see how some repairing of the soil would first need to take place? Hormonal birth control destroys the lining of the womb, a mother's fertile ground. <br /><br />The same people who do not allow God to be in charge of whether and when they are going to have children are the same people who would not trust him with their family size if they could get pregnant easily. It takes the same type of absolute faith in God to keep having children in a world as volatile as ours as to have faith that if I did not get pregnant, it would be because that was God's will. This point is proven by the fact that women who first use IVF, then find that their natural fertility is restored, go on to use birth control to stop having more children than they want.<br /><br />The difference is not "fertile" vs. "infertile", it is "trusting God" vs. "taking the place of God".<br /><br />Whether or not you spent a lot of thought on this decision, and whether or not your hearts were heavy, has no bearing at all on whether it was morally right. The vast majority of women who have abortions do so with a heavy heart and after spending much thought on it, but that does not make their decision any less wrong. <br /><br />Women will do anything to get pregnant, and they will do anything not to get pregnant. Some of the methods they are willing to use, while technically available to us, are still wrong and immoral based on the Bible's standard, not mine. <br /><br />I have no issue with you personally. But I stand by my opinion that IVF is morally reprehensible, just as much if not more than abortion and murder.Zsuzsannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03062136377263894876noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-57123583441235237742010-04-25T18:54:18.202-07:002010-04-25T18:54:18.202-07:00You don't have to publish this comment but I t...You don't have to publish this comment but I thought you would be interested. Here is Gianna speaking at a parliment building in Australia. <br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPF1FhCMPuQAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08408209728726490363noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-50192445747087485202010-04-25T18:50:50.905-07:002010-04-25T18:50:50.905-07:00Wow. How very sad. There is a down's syndrome ...Wow. How very sad. There is a down's syndrome baby in my church that the parents (who do not attend my church...her grandparents bring her) were planning to abort. Through much prayer and guidance, they didn't abort her and now she is a rambuncious, beautiful two and a half year old. <br /><br />It is never safe to even tamper with the idea of abortion. <br /><br />Have you ever read the book entitled "Gianna"? It is about a little girl who survived an attempted saline abortion. She is now a very accomplished speaker against abortion and is such an inspiration. She is also a christian. The side effect of the abortion is a mild case of Cerebral Palsey...her birth mother gave her up for adoption. Tragic beginning...blessed ending!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08408209728726490363noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-27545096587714833592010-04-25T18:50:50.906-07:002010-04-25T18:50:50.906-07:00That is horribly sad and just so backwards. At lea...That is horribly sad and just so backwards. At least he is fired and I pray never is able to do an abortion again. So sad.<br /><br />Jessicajhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07333867623075088666noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-24479154838250383742010-04-25T18:38:00.071-07:002010-04-25T18:38:00.071-07:00Don't these so called doctors take an oath to ...Don't these so called doctors take an oath to SAVE LIVES, NOT TAKE THEM?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05456238241747350224noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-82691586984163931392010-04-25T18:12:13.467-07:002010-04-25T18:12:13.467-07:00I didn't read your entire article, but not ALL...I didn't read your entire article, but not ALL of those who want to do IVF do it for the perfect child. Some of us do it because it's the only way we areable to have kids....and if it doesn't work...then I'll adopt. I think it's awful that the parents would abort a child with downs syndrome. <br /><br />It's with an awful broad stroke that you think most people that do IVF do so because it's "the perfect race" thing. Most of us would much rather be able to have kids at the rate you and your husband are able to but for some of us it just isn't possible. There isn't anything I wouldn't give up to have kids "the natural way".....but that wasn't the plan for my life. We'll probably adopt too, but who doesn't want to have their own biological child. I sure think it's easy to pass judgement when you haven't walked in someone elses shoes. <br /><br /><br />I'm in NO WAY condoning what these ridiculous parents (and doctor) did. They'll pay the price for it one day.Hopehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02976711831330274977noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-26678513536681129192010-04-25T17:02:40.945-07:002010-04-25T17:02:40.945-07:00Just on point three, it does actually say that the...Just on point three, it does actually say that they did go on to abort the second foetus. From the article:<br />Records show that after the "wrong" baby was killed in the first abortion, a second abortion was done to kill the disabled unborn child as well.<br /><br />IVF is one thing that you and I are always, always going to disagree on. My first child is IVF and by no means was she planned to be a 'perfect token child to add to my perfectly planned life'. I would say that the vast majority of people who embark on IVF do so with a heavy heart and a lot of thought. I won't go into my husband's and myself's thought processes as I suspect you are not really interested. However, if you are, I will share with you what our reasoning was. But suffice to say there was a lot of discussion in this house before we went down that roadAlicehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04080737213758433563noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3454355557116314654.post-29812530565458443242010-04-25T16:05:25.339-07:002010-04-25T16:05:25.339-07:00That's pretty depressing all around...That's pretty depressing all around...Zetsubouhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04656943283705831467noreply@blogger.com